Plagiarist Palahniuk

[QUOTE=izen;972592]i'm suprised that nobody has pulled out the "there are no original idea's anymore!" argument.[/QUOTE]

What? Like:

[QUOTE=Chixulub;972561]There's nothing new under the sun.

And the whole notion that started this thread is a heresy against Chuck Palahniuk, the infallable author of All That's Worth Reading. We are a Cult. We must gang up and kill this interloper...instigator...whatever.

Let's drum him out of the Cult before he gets is Self Seriousness on us![/QUOTE]

[SIZE=6]???[/SIZE]

ahem
[QUOTE=izen;972639]you mean me saying there aren't any original idea's out there anymore isn't an original quote!

...oh, and somehow i missed what Chixilub posted.
i'd ask Chixilub to forgive me for this terrible mistake, but i read a book once where someone asked someone else for forgiveness and i don't want to be a plagiarist. i already feel so guilty hitting the 'Submit Reply' button like i'm some sort of robotic lemming chode.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=izen;972939]ahem

[IMG]http://midwestrocklobster.com/051707/queenizen1.jpg[/IMG]

Well, I'd forgive Izen, but it would be unoriginal. So would hating Izen. Or using him as an answer option in a poll.

Fortunately, naming a pink and purple rocket after Izen, and making it a transgender rocket ([URL=http://midwestrocklobster.blogspot.com/2006/10/death-of-queen-izen.html]Queen Izen[/URL]), then launching it on an engine too small for its weight and drag with disastrous consequences, well, I'm pretty sure I can claim that one for myself.

[IMG]http://midwestrocklobster.com/051707/queenizen2.jpg[/IMG]

No harm, no foul. Your sins were washed away in uncoiling paper tubing. You may now admire your Original Messiah.

[IMG]http://midwestrocklobster.com/051707/queenizen3.jpg[/IMG]

. .

[font=tahoma]you know, i just noticed today that cormac mccarthy's novel [i]child of god[/i] is structured uncomfortably similar to faulkner's [i]as i lay dying[/i]. im absolutely appauled. i wont read anything by him again. and never again will i allow my woman to read any of his books. in fact, she has only a few pages left of [i]the road[/i] and i dont think ill let her finish it. it's now unclean and i can't eat--goodbye, cormac, you unoriginal bastard thief !
-kabol

.[/font]

fact:
Muddy Waters played guitar
The Beatles, later, also played guitars

Thieves!!!!

[QUOTE=JKabol;973358]. .

[font=tahoma]you know, i just noticed today that cormac mccarthy's novel [i]child of god[/i] is structured uncomfortably similar to faulkner's [i]as i lay dying[/i]. im absolutely appauled. i wont read anything by him again. and never again will i allow my woman to read any of his books. in fact, she has only a few pages left of [i]the road[/i] and i dont think ill let her finish it. it's now unclean and i can't eat--goodbye, cormac, you unoriginal bastard thief !
-kabol

.[/font][/QUOTE]

The Road is easily McCarthy's least original book. End times? Been there, done that. Nostalgia for a can of Coke? Pullleeeze, biatch. A father who loves his son beyond reason, achtung-cliche!

[QUOTE=morey;972748]I'd like to crash a car right now into someones fat fucking head.[/QUOTE]
I'm right behind you man.

[QUOTE=nathaniel parker;973363]fact:
Muddy Waters played guitar
The Beatles, later, also played guitars

Thieves!!!![/QUOTE]

it gets worse - they used the SAME CHORDS

[QUOTE=nathaniel parker;973363]fact:
Muddy Waters played guitar
The Beatles, later, also played guitars

Thieves!!!![/QUOTE]

Gotta call you on this one, Nate. The difference between Muddy Waters and the Beatles is Muddy Waters did not suck, Muddy Waters was not lame, and Muddy Waters was not an infected boil on the ass of 20th Century music.

ouch.

[QUOTE=Chixulub;973371]Gotta call you on this one, Nate. The difference between Muddy Waters and the Beatles is Muddy Waters did not suck, Muddy Waters was not lame, and Muddy Waters was not an infected boil on the ass of 20th Century music.[/QUOTE]Amen

Morey and me agree. The end times are truly at hand.

yessss.

[QUOTE=Chixulub;973371]Gotta call you on this one, Nate. The difference between Muddy Waters and the Beatles is Muddy Waters did not suck, Muddy Waters was not lame, and Muddy Waters was not an infected boil on the ass of 20th Century music.[/QUOTE]

that was pretty much the original comparision though wasn't it?
that Ballard was good and Chuck sucked?

[QUOTE=Chixulub;973338]Well, I'd forgive Izen, but it would be unoriginal. So would hating Izen. [B]Or using him as an answer option in a poll.[/B][/QUOTE]

noooooooooooooooooooo!
wait, is that even still going on? i haven't seen a poll in a while.
also, i am flattered that you took so much time to reply to me. it feels nice to be noticed and appreciated for what i am, even if all i am is a failed phallic gender-balanced monarch of the skies that was destroyed by the whims and poor calculations of a dude named Chixilub who thought four GODDAMED FINS WASN'T TOO MUCH FUCKING DRAG!
are you free friday? i like italian food and unprotected sex.

That was a little harsh, Izen. Your use of the word cunt was poorly timed.

Anyway, I'm going to say I was expecting something better from Rant, and yeah, I'm gonna admit I was dissapointed. Chuck Palahniuk is an odd man, smart, but I don't know what he's playing at. I'm not too fussed about originality, but the book was sore. I think it might have been the oral-autobiography deal of it. Chuck goes on a lot about not underestimating your readers, about that's why they shun most books today, and he really spelled out every last word with this piece. He should have left more to thought.

[QUOTE=corellion;973458]That was a little harsh, Izen. Your use of the word cunt was poorly timed.[/QUOTE]

so what you're telling me is that there are times when it is appropriate to call a little girl a cunt, but this is just not one of those times?

I would've called this thread Palah-giarist.

i would've called this thread "Plagiarist Palahniuk", except that's already the name of a thread so i would've been plagiarisizamating and expecting credit for originality like i was the author of Fight Club or something. also that thread name is this thread name and so nobody would've picked up on it.

[QUOTE=UbikRex;972589]Shouldn't he just have mixed the two words together making a new one for the thread title.

Like Palahgiarist or Palagiariuk.
[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Vendetta;973462]I would've called this thread Palah-giarist.[/QUOTE]

Well who's the palahgiarist now?!

I didn't read the rest of the thread.

I am thoroughly shamed.

Hey Chuck, wait up!

[QUOTE=izen;973459]so what you're telling me is that there are times when it is appropriate to call a little girl a cunt, but this is just not one of those times?[/QUOTE]

Of course there are plenty of times appropriate to call a little girl a cunt. Izen, you just don't have the skills to use that word properly. You suck.

I'm the cunt who put an A motor in Queen Izen. My daughter only retreived the wreckage.

[QUOTE=corellion;973458]That was a little harsh, Izen. Your use of the word cunt was poorly timed.

Anyway, I'm going to say I was expecting something better from Rant, and yeah, I'm gonna admit I was dissapointed. Chuck Palahniuk is an odd man, smart, but I don't know what he's playing at. I'm not too fussed about originality, but the book was sore. I think it might have been the oral-autobiography deal of it. Chuck goes on a lot about not underestimating your readers, about that's why they shun most books today, and he really spelled out every last word with this piece. He should have left more to thought.[/QUOTE]if you wanna read a really good oral auto bio read the one obout the history of porn by legs mcniel, i read it last summer and really enjoyed it! i forget the name though.

I would have called this thread "Ask Karbunkle Anything" !

[QUOTE=morey;973505]if you wanna read a really good oral auto bio read the one obout the history of porn by legs mcniel, i read it last summer and really enjoyed it! i forget the name though.[/QUOTE]

I don't like biographies. I like books where something happens.

it's educational dumbass!

[QUOTE=corellion;973527]I don't like biographies. I like books where something happens.[/QUOTE]

get the Chuck Yeager autobiography
that's got all kinds of shit happening in it!

[QUOTE=Chixulub;973494]I'm the cunt who put an A motor in Queen Izen. My daughter only retreived the wreckage.[/QUOTE]

oh shit. that was your site?

oh wow i feel horrible. i thought you did a google search for Izen and found that. i apologize.
i feel like a total ass.

edit: i went back and read your post, noticed you said "naming a rocket after Izen", but i didn't pick up on that when i read it the first time. i apologize again.

re-edit: i went back and edited it out my comment, hopefully that makes it alllll better.

Re-re-re-re-edit: We don't need no satisfaction.

I'm pretty sure Crash is about people who are sexually turned on by car accidents.

The only resemblance I see is that they have car accidents in them. You could say Survivor is a rip off because it has to do with a cult, or a plane crash, Invisible Monsters because it has to do with models, ect, ect. How many books are there with those topics? But Chuck's books are a lot more than just the topic.
I don' think you could call the Crash-Rant resemblance plagiarism at all.

[QUOTE=Instigator;972396]I have read the book of Crash, and corresponded with JG Ballard, but apart from that....actually, yes, I did see the Cronenberg movie. So?

You fans really can't handle when it's pointed out the guy is ripping other people off, can you?[/QUOTE]

You're an imbecile

Since the dawn of time millions of books have been written by millions of people.

And you mean to tell us that out of all those millions upon millions upon millions of books... by all those millions and millions of writers... no two of them ever had similar ideas?

By your logic everybody should just stop writing because you can bet your ass there ain't a subject known to man that hasn't already been written about.

[QUOTE=TwistedVision;973670]You're an imbecile

Since the dawn of time millions of books have been written by millions of people.

And you mean to tell us that out of all those millions upon millions upon millions of books... by all those millions and millions of writers... no two of them ever had similar ideas?

By your logic everybody should just stop writing because you can bet your ass there ain't a subject known to man that hasn't already been written about.[/QUOTE]
We must be careful, when rebuking idiotic arguments, not to resort to idiocy ourselves.

but thats why i like this thread, its a stupidamitator (sic)

I love it when internet discussions turn into "ur ignorent"-"no UR ignorent" exchanges.

Your sister loves it. She loves it [U]all[/U] [U]night[/U] [U]long[/U].

Yess'm.

Rant was written by [I]Palahniuk[/I]??? :eek: I thought I was reading a [I]Quentin Tarantino[/I] script! :confused: I guess it just goes to show you my total inability to experience anything as new :rolleyes:

[QUOTE=meatthinker;974843]Rant was written by [I]Palahniuk[/I]??? :eek: I thought I was reading a [I]Quentin Tarantino[/I] script! :confused: I guess it just goes to show you my total inability to experience anything as new :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

Don't fuck it up for me. I love Chuck, but I hated Haunted. And I love Tarantino, but Kill Bill should have gotten him beheaded.

I don't wanna know, let me find it on my own...

[QUOTE=Instigator;972389]I read an interview talking about Rant (which I have not read) which states that it is, in part, about a gang of teen car-crash enthusiasts who crash into each other to feel alive. Now why does this sound as if it is ripped off WHOLESALE from this book (which came out in the fucking SEVENTIES!):

[url]http://www.amazon.com/Crash-Novel-J-G-Ballard/dp/0312420331/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2/002-2536474-5297662?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1179263882&sr=1-2[/url]

I know Palahniuk is ludicrously compared to Ballard, but they're poles apart and Ballard is a FAR better writer/theoretician. And I know Palahniuk harvests his psychofantic fans for stories for his books so he doesn't have to make up his own ideas. But does he have to be such a BLATANT rip-off merchant?

Get a clue, Palahniuk. Invent something. That's what writers with imagination DO.

G.[/QUOTE]
Good article/interview with Chuck and he addresses the Ballard comparison and admits his own lack of original thought. Bummer for you....

[url]http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=10527[/url]

huh. so, yeah, i'm sitting here wanting to defend Chuck, but more and more his habit of getting idea's from readers and such sort of bothers me. i haven't even read Rant yet, partly because i can't find it anywhere over here in Germany, but i haven't made an effort to find it after being disappointed by what little i read of Haunted. i miss the Fight Club days, when it was all fresh and exciting stuff. i'm not saying i'm going to cancel my Fan Of Chuck membership, but, damn, even he's admitting it now... of course, he denies copying Crash in that interview, and just says what we've said here, which is something that's already been said before, which is that there are no original idea's.
i suppose i should give Rant a chance, but i'm afraid i'll be as disappointed with it as i was with Haunted and most of the poorly written, horrible 'articles' in Stranger Than Fiction.

[QUOTE=izen;975619]huh. so, yeah, i'm sitting here wanting to defend Chuck, but more and more his habit of getting idea's from readers and such sort of bothers me. i haven't even read Rant yet, partly because i can't find it anywhere over here in Germany, but i haven't made an effort to find it after being disappointed by what little i read of Haunted. i miss the Fight Club days, when it was all fresh and exciting stuff. i'm not saying i'm going to cancel my Fan Of Chuck membership, but, damn, even he's admitting it now... of course, he denies copying Crash in that interview, and just says what we've said here, which is something that's already been said before, which is that there are no original idea's.
i suppose i should give Rant a chance, but i'm afraid i'll be as disappointed with it as i was with Haunted and most of the poorly written, horrible 'articles' in Stranger Than Fiction.[/QUOTE]
izen,

Wie gehts? Friedburg, huh? Lived in Heidelberg & Mannheim from 2001-2005. Awesome. Anyway, having read both Crash and Rant, the only thing the two have in common is that people crash their cars on purpose. In Crash they do it for sexual purposes, and in Rant, well, not so much. Ballard has some kind of fixation on car crashes and deals with the theme in more depth in the very confusing, but curiously satisfying "The Atrocity Exhibition". Palahniuk's use is much more restrained and for very specific purposes.

I really thought Chuck peaked with Lullaby (and everything leading up to that). Since then, I haven't been as blown away by his books (especially Diary), but did find something to like in each. I went into Rant with lowered expectations and devoured it in three days. I've never done that with one of his books. Of course, Chuck's biggest problem is that he's "Chuck Palahniuk", and his status as icon has overshadowed his work.

Give Rant a chance. I think you'll like it.

[QUOTE=Drunk Irish Bastard;975623]izen,

Wie gehts? Friedburg, huh? Lived in Heidelberg & Mannheim from 2001-2005. Awesome. Anyway, having read both Crash and Rant, the only thing the two have in common is that people crash their cars on purpose. In Crash they do it for sexual purposes, and in Rant, well, not so much. Ballard has some kind of fixation on car crashes and deals with the theme in more depth in the very confusing, but curiously satisfying "The Atrocity Exhibition". Palahniuk's use is much more restrained and for very specific purposes.

I really thought Chuck peaked with Lullaby (and everything leading up to that). Since then, I haven't been as blown away by his books (especially Diary), but did find something to like in each. I went into Rant with lowered expectations and devoured it in three days. I've never done that with one of his books. Of course, Chuck's biggest problem is that he's "Chuck Palahniuk", and his status as icon has overshadowed his work.

Give Rant a chance. I think you'll like it.[/QUOTE]

i live in Frieberg but i'm moving to Baumholder next week. i've been near Heidelberg, i think we did some training near there. i'm in the US Army, by the way.
i saw the movie Crash, which from what i hear focused more on the sexual aspect, and i know from what i've read here that the part in Rant is quite different. it's just little by little over the last few years there's been more and more references to unoriginality and using other's idea's. this Rant/Crash thing is probably not the best example.
i plan to give Rant a try, and maybe retry Haunted and try to finish it. i'll be going back to the states on leave soon and will grab my copy of Haunted and pick up Rant (as well as a hundred other books i can't find here); i would be elated if i found i was able to get excited over Chuck books again, so i am planning to try to go in with an open mind.
i agree with the whole "he's Chuck Palahniuk" thing. i'm hoping to someday publish a book and i've wondered about how it would feel to balance your career between being too popular and too "underground." it's awesome that Fight Club got Chuck such a good name but he'll be forever linked to it foremost in the minds of all those who consider him just another author they enjoy reading whenever a book happens to come out.

[QUOTE=izen;975630]i live in Frieberg but i'm moving to Baumholder next week. i've been near Heidelberg, i think we did some training near there. i'm in the US Army, by the way.
i saw the movie Crash, which from what i hear focused more on the sexual aspect, and i know from what i've read here that the part in Rant is quite different. it's just little by little over the last few years there's been more and more references to unoriginality and using other's idea's. this Rant/Crash thing is probably not the best example.
i plan to give Rant a try, and maybe retry Haunted and try to finish it. i'll be going back to the states on leave soon and will grab my copy of Haunted and pick up Rant (as well as a hundred other books i can't find here); i would be elated if i found i was able to get excited over Chuck books again, so i am planning to try to go in with an open mind.
i agree with the whole "he's Chuck Palahniuk" thing. i'm hoping to someday publish a book and i've wondered about how it would feel to balance your career between being too popular and too "underground." it's awesome that Fight Club got Chuck such a good name but he'll be forever linked to it foremost in the minds of all those who consider him just another author they enjoy reading whenever a book happens to come out.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, me too (about the Army thing). I think Chuck would have a field day imbedding himself in an infantry unit for a few weeks. I'd love to see his take on military life. I can't believe they don't have Rant at the bookstore on post. I was there when Lullaby came out and they had tons of copies. Interesting.....

In my opinion, Chuck rips himself off more than anyone else (there's even a bit of self-reference in Rant with fight clubs.....pretty cool).

[QUOTE=Drunk Irish Bastard;975634]Yeah, me too (about the Army thing). I think Chuck would have a field day imbedding himself in an infantry unit for a few weeks. I'd love to see his take on military life. I can't believe they don't have Rant at the bookstore on post. I was there when Lullaby came out and they had tons of copies. Interesting.....

In my opinion, Chuck rips himself off more than anyone else (there's even a bit of self-reference in Rant with fight clubs.....pretty cool).[/QUOTE]

damn, nice to run into another soldier stationed in germany.
i take it you're in infantry. you 11b?
68w myself.

i doubt chuck approves of the army or the current war. i just get the feeling somehow he's not the kind of guy to agree with it. probably hates Bush.
i've never seen Chuck at any px but i really haven't been to too many of the bigger px's.

[QUOTE=izen;975637]damn, nice to run into another soldier stationed in germany.
i take it you're in infantry. you 11b?
68w myself.

i doubt chuck approves of the army or the current war. i just get the feeling somehow he's not the kind of guy to agree with it. probably hates Bush.
i've never seen Chuck at any px but i really haven't been to too many of the bigger px's.[/QUOTE]
Nah, not 11B. Color blind. I was a 27D, but am out now. I still have lots of friends over there and go back when I can. I'm not so sure they support the war either, but a soldier's life isn't his own (you know what I mean). Anthony Swofford did a pretty good job examining the modern absurdities of military life through his biography Jarhead (of course Catch 22 is my all time favorite military novel), and actually did a decent job with his follow up (and first shot at fiction) "Exit A". It's a great read, especially if you've had the opportunity to visit or live in Japan. I noticed some "Palahniuk-esque" tendencies in his writing as well.

Hopefully your gaining unit isn't moving out anytime soon.....

[QUOTE=Drunk Irish Bastard;975640]Nah, not 11B. Color blind. I was a 27D, but am out now. I still have lots of friends over there and go back when I can. I'm not so sure they support the war either, but a soldier's life isn't his own (you know what I mean). Anthony Swofford did a pretty good job examining the modern absurdities of military life through his biography Jarhead (of course Catch 22 is my all time favorite military novel), and actually did a decent job with his follow up (and first shot at fiction) "Exit A". It's a great read, especially if you've had the opportunity to visit or live in Japan. I noticed some "Palahniuk-esque" tendencies in his writing as well.

Hopefully your gaining unit isn't moving out anytime soon.....[/QUOTE]

going back to Iraq before the year ends probably.
i'm colorblind too, which is why i'm a medic. i was gonna go for Linguist or Interogator, but can't do intel with color retarded eye-ballses. oh well.
27D. Had to look that one up. Ah, a pogue! Hey, it's a job.

[QUOTE=izen;975642]going back to Iraq before the year ends probably.
i'm colorblind too, which is why i'm a medic. i was gonna go for Linguist or Interogator, but can't do intel with color retarded eye-ballses. oh well.
27D. Had to look that one up. Ah, a pogue! Hey, it's a job.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, initially I went for linguist (got a 110 on the dlab) but they didn't tell me I was disqualified until after I passed the test and took the physical. Ugh. But, I had a good time; no regrets (seen some crazy stuff too). Keep your head down over there and stay safe; you have a hell of a job.......

[QUOTE=Drunk Irish Bastard;975645]Yeah, initially I went for linguist (got a 110 on the dlab) but they didn't tell me I was disqualified until after I passed the test and took the physical. Ugh. But, I had a good time; no regrets (seen some crazy stuff too). Keep your head down over there and stay safe; you have a hell of a job.......[/QUOTE]

Born to kill! Trained to heal! Hooah! Or something! ugh....
yeah, i probably won't be going out the gate this time around.
i never even got around to taking the dlab. i think i would've done good.

oh yeah, the thread subject.
uh, stuff about Rant and Crash! wtf and stuff!

I can't make any arguments about people's perceptions of Chuck's writing, but I can say that whatever your feelings, it's not plagiarism. Look up the legal definition. If there was overt plagiarism going on, lawsuits would be flying. I just see it as an author exploring subjects that are common to people. One of the things I appreciate about Chuck's work is that he's slowly trying to break into different voices with each book. His early work (my favorites) all seemed to be like watching old Schwarzenegger movies (stay with me here...). The same guy as different characters (ie - Arnold in the Future! Arnold vs an alien!; Chuck as the narrator, Chuck as Vincent, etc etc.) With Haunted, and Rant moreso, Chuck seems to be pulling further away from writing characters in his voice and getting more texture in his work. Digging on these (very) mild plot similarities, as my playwiritng professor used to say, is like picking fly shit out of pepper. Show me some structural similarities and significant plot devices used in the same manner and I'll think about this argument. otherwise, read and enjoy (or not).