L.A. Protesters met by TANKS.

Sometimes I just can't over how safe this country is. I feel so fucking safe I want to tear the eyeballs out of kittens, that's how fucking safe I feel.

America is going to be the location of the next "Tiananmen Square" incident.

[QUOTE=izen]America is going to be the location of the next "Tiananmen Square" incident.[/QUOTE]
I can't wait until my kids get to watch the sanitized government funded educational movie about the Incident in Times Square. My kids will finally know the truth about the dangers of free speach and public demonstration. There were terrorists in that mob in 2006, we had no choice but to open fire with our tanks.

Holy shit. That's fucking scary as hell. I want to know who the genius was that ordered those tanks out there. That is totally fucked. I mean, seriously, you only hear about tanks being moved on protesters in countries that are about to go through something really effed up. Hold onto your butts.

Tanks and protesters meet. I don't want to be inflamatory to anyone, but the effed up shit is already happening. We should have holding our butts for a long time now. When the leader of the most powerful country in the world is elected by a slim majority with his current war among the top issues, he had better fucking solidify his position by making sure protestors know who's boss.

mungkay, you've made about a billion threads (or more than anyone else, anyway) about American politics, and yet your location says "Canada." What's all this about?

[QUOTE=Ballerina]mungkay, you've made about a billion threads (or more than anyone else, anyway) about American politics, and yet your location says "Canada." What's all this about?[/QUOTE]

I guess I could make a bunch of masterbation threads or some zany poll, but I like discussing current events.

and BTW, my FIVE threads are only slightly ahead of trailfodder's three.

weird. was the tank even there to break up the protest? it seems like it was just sitting there from what i saw. i think you guys might be blowing this out of proportion. maybe eventually the government will start running people over with tanks and spraying machine gun fire into crowds but this isn't even in the same ballpark as that. incidently, there was a bit of a riot where i live recently and riot equipped police gassed and dispersed the crowd which was turning over cars and throwing rocks at people. thinking back i would have loved to hear about the military coming in and just indiscriminantly killing rioters.

the low rumble of the tanks sound like thunder. for a moment the rioters pause in unison. an 18-wheel truck full of light infantry pulls up and the men begin setting up fire zones. two more humvees join the line. one with a 50-cal machine gun mount and the other with an automatic grenade launcher. the rioters stand there dumbfounded, rocks still in hand standing next to some poor bastards turned over car and the kid who's lying there bleeding because he got hit with a flying rock. they want to turn and run, but they know they can't escape. "Open fire!" someone barks out from behind the line no sooner than flashes and cracks erupt. frattards and overzealous sports fans collapse one by one as the giggling gaggles of girls that were egging them on run for cover. a 20mm automatic grenade launcher sweeps across the concealment and severed limbs, purses and halloween costume remnants all leap into the air at once like some demented graduation ceremony. the fire ceases. the only sound that can be heard is the clop clop of high heels. "Aww she's dressed as an angel", says one of the men in the 50-cal mounted humvee. before he can even finish his sentence the 50-cal starts up pounding the air. as they watch the flash of the tracers penetrate the desperate angel's back the air around her now mangled corpse is filled with a red mist. in the end the human race had taken a step forward and all those assholes who i had wished would die were dead. now i can finally get some fucking sleep.

[QUOTE=shpongleyesd]thinking back i would have loved to hear about the military coming in and just indiscriminantly killing rioters.[/QUOTE]

Enjoy: [url]http://www.spectacle.org/595/kent.html[/url]

Tanks don't just roll down LA streets on a day to day basis. And they certainly don't stop in front of a group of protesters just for the hell of it. No, there weren't any guns pointed at the protesters, but nobody can say that this was a coincidence.

I am unsure how Tanks showing up a demonstration of protesters against he President can be percieved as a "coincidence". Don't forget that the governement really likes to shove their fucked up ideas right down the publics throat. They may not fire their guns, I agree that's a long way off. But then again, they might not get the opportunity fire those umpteen millimetre rounds if the tanks never showed up inthe first place. Maybe, just maybe only thinking out loud here, the warning shot never got fired. Maybe the warning shot was a silent round. I know there are tanks in America, but then, they never pointed the fuckers at me before. Wow that's what a tank looks like, maybe I should rethink my whole stance on this issue

[QUOTE=mungkay]I guess I could make a bunch of masterbation threads or some zany poll, but I like discussing current events.

and BTW, my FIVE threads are only slightly ahead of trailfodder's three.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I noticed his threads too. It's just that the location thing confused me. Besides, I'm sure there are other thing going on in the world than Bush being re-elected. Why not start a thread about something obscure and make people aware of it?

There were some inquires to a local base asking if the tank merely got lost in Los Angeles traffic, to which the soldier replyed to by laughing, and calling the idea absurd.

I'm going to take a shot in the dark and say that the military was testing to see how long it would take to get to a location if protesters were to go apeshit one day.

[QUOTE=Ballerina]Besides, I'm sure there are other thing going on in the world than Bush being re-elected. Why not start a thread about something obscure and make people aware of it?[/QUOTE]

Would you be asking me these questions if I lived below the 49th parallel?

[QUOTE=Ballerina]Yeah, I noticed his threads too. It's just that the location thing confused me. Besides, I'm sure there are other thing going on in the world than Bush being re-elected. Why not start a thread about something obscure and make people aware of it?[/QUOTE]

Because at this point, this is what people need to be aware of. This isn't just about Bush being re-elected. This is about someone having the nerve to roll tanks on protesters. This is what could potentially be the end of our first amendment rights. This is some fucked up shit. If you want to start a thread about the shit going down in Darfur, go for it, but this is the stuff that Mungkay feels the need to present and I, for one, am grateful for it.

No offense.

[QUOTE=Rents]Because at this point, this is what people need to be aware of. This isn't just about Bush being re-elected. This is about someone having the nerve to roll tanks on protesters. This is what could potentially be the end of our first amendment rights. This is some fucked up shit. If you want to start a thread about the shit going down in Darfur, go for it, but this is the stuff that Mungkay feels the need to present and I, for one, am grateful for it.

No offense.[/QUOTE]

Everyone across the globe should be interested to the going ons of the states, especially when a lot of people start asking "how bad is it going to get?" in the largest "democracy" on the planet.

I mean the USA ranks [b]17th[/b] in the world in freedom of the press. Seventeeth. Think about that.

[QUOTE=mungkay]Would you be asking me these questions if I lived below the 49th parallel?[/QUOTE]
Most likely not.

Well Mungkay you have your wish. I don't think the collective American ego can get big enough. America IS important, if it weren't the whole world wouldn't have watched the election, but they did. American citizens need to realise how important they are on a world scale. The reason so many Canadians talk about this shit is because it affects them, it affects everyone. that's how important America is. So to Americans I say suck it up and accept the responsibility. The government you didn't chose is running the world and has a blank cheque they are dying to cash.

i see your points. tanks are scary, its true. even if they aren't shooting incindiary rounds into your house. they were probably just trying to intimidate the protesters. but if your ideas can't stand a little intimidation then they aren't meant to survive. i'm not saying i agree with the war in iraq but who gives a shit if the government is trying to intimidate us? they're not telling us that we can't protest yet. so fuck'em the only thing those tanks are saying is that big brother noticed those protesters. it just gives more power to their position really. i don't think "pulling the troops out now" is really a viable solution though. maybe the protesters in that video clip didn't mean it literally but pulling out our soldiers now will turn iraq into the next afghanistan. and i've heard from people who visited afghanistan (before we went in there) that it was not a nice place at all. he described it as a shelter for the worst of the worst of the worlds criminals. i know a lot of you peace loving hippies out there are gonna have something to say about it but we're at war now period. and its not gonna finish itself if our army leaves abruptly. of course, i don't think i agree with starting any more wars. so you just might see me on the picket line if bush sends our boys to syria.

[QUOTE=mungkay]There were some inquires to a local base asking if the tank merely got lost in Los Angeles traffic, to which the soldier replyed to by laughing, and calling the idea absurd.

I'm going to take a shot in the dark and say that the military was testing to see how long it would take to get to a location if protesters were to go apeshit one day.[/QUOTE]
that sounds like a theory. in the video the tank just didn't look like it was having much effect. it actually seemed like the guy on top of the tank was having a conversation with some protesters.

did you really just say "who gives a shit if the government is trying to intimidate us?"

the government is supposed to be run by and be protecting the citizens, not intimidating them from speaking out against the politics of their nation. if you don't get this, you've already given up your life for the benefit of a few politicians.

Well tank pilots are people too. I'll bet even if they did get order to open fire they wouldn't, anymore than that tank in China did when that kid stepped infront of it. The main problem as that the message is "We have tanks so shut up please." the anit-war effort has lost all of it's steam, I don't think the government is worried avout it anymore. You are right to say, America is a war period. Deal with it. It's too late. How do you know it's too late? Well, we're pointing howitzers at you now. You have to wonder where the tanks will turn up next. Pro Choice demonstrations? Gay Marriage demonstrations? Maybe we should to see how many more coincidences happen. I don't want to jump the gun here either, it could be a total fluke. Let's hope the tank drivers don't jump the gun either

[QUOTE=trypdwyre]did you really just say "who gives a shit if the government is trying to intimidate us?"

the government is supposed to be run by and be protecting the citizens, not intimidating them from speaking out against the politics of their nation. if you don't get this, you've already given up your life for the benefit of a few politicians.[/QUOTE]
heh, they have to load the gun first. i would protest if there was something affecting my life that these evil politicians were doing. but actually there isn't really. maybe at some point i'll hit a brick wall that i don't think should be there and try to rally other people to help me tear it down but i'm not going to pace around yelling looking like an idiot over pure conjecture. i'm not saying its ok from a political science standpoint for the government to try to intimidate people but it doesn't cross any legal boundary. they are not prohibiting anything. if anything we should be complaining about the precious fuel oil that those tanks wasted going to that protest. instead we're gearing up for a civil war that's not going to happen. it just seems a little bit sensationalist to me that's all.

Unfortunatly hindsight is 20-20. We won't know whether or not this is sensationalism for a while yet. I have a prohpesy thread started, feel free to throw all of your "crazy" ideas in there. Be sensational, or not. Although if someone had of prophesied tanks would end up at a peacful demonstration four years ago, we have called them nuts. Looky look.

Huh, so that's why traffic to work sucked so bad the other day. I wonder why I haven't heard anything about this yet, and I kind of wish I were there to protest.

Makes me nervous.

that's true. there is always the possibility that in the end i will be thinking "man those guys were right." i'm actually hoping that you guys are right. i think that such a thing would unify our country in a way that hasn't been seen since the revolution. it would be a beautiful thing i think. costly but beautiful.

[QUOTE=Rents]Enjoy: [url]http://www.spectacle.org/595/kent.html[/url]

Tanks don't just roll down LA streets on a day to day basis. And they certainly don't stop in front of a group of protesters just for the hell of it. No, there weren't any guns pointed at the protesters, but nobody can say that this was a coincidence.[/QUOTE]
that's what i'm talking about! i just got a chance to read that article. it would have been great if they had just wiped out every last one of those overzealous hippies. its funny how in a riot such as this you only hear about the casualties caused by the authorities who take on the responsibility of stopping it never the casualties that would have been caused by it mushrooming out of control until people are getting trampled or hit with projectiles meant to damage cars or buildings. no matter what the cause, when people protest violently it speaks against the constitution. and the people described in that article were protesting violently. i'll start worrying when unbiased sources start talking about things like this (unbiased this article is not).

Hmm, that's the trouble with sarcasm, you can never tell whether people are serious or not. Doesn't make me nervous, makes me trust sarcasm less. Sorry, I'm just being sarcastic.

i guess the best way to deal with it is just to say its coincidence and not to get inflamed by it. it might as well be coincidence then because it won't have any effect. there's no point in reacting at all unless the tanks start shooting is all i'm saying. and even then, the question "is this a peaceful assembly?" must be asked. or rather should have been asked before the tanks started shooting. if the answer is no then i'd say good riddance because i'd rather see people that would participate in something like that dead anyway. its definitely another matter if the police/military start shooting first though. then its no longer a demonstration. its a war.

i started getting worried myself when they put snipers in times square on new years 2002. i never went to the new york ceremony but if i had i certainly wouldn't have gone that year. i mean, those snipers definitely weren't there solely to try and intimidate people. i wonder how many dudes 'disappeared' that night because they wandered into an alley with a suspicious backpack. probly none but you can't really you gotta wonder. that's something that the military or whoever would definitely cover up.

[QUOTE=shpongleyesd]that sounds like a theory. in the video the tank just didn't look like it was having much effect. it actually seemed like the guy on top of the tank was having a conversation with some protesters.[/QUOTE]

That's exactly what it was, a theory. I was thinking about it today, and say, IF there was a draft, there could be a LOT of angry people rioting in the streets, and a military presence might be requested.

But again I'm just speculating.

I'm sorry to hear about the many terrorists in America. No, I don't think they should be gunned down by snipers in the alleys, but I do think they should be gunned down. Perhaps we could right out there in public. Perhaps on news years eve we should publicly execute all suspected terrorists in Time Square, on t.v and everything, it'd be better than the SuperBowl. Who would buy shares in that idead? Well, me.

[QUOTE=joeyjojojrshabadoo]Hmm, that's the trouble with sarcasm, you can never tell whether people are serious or not. Doesn't make me nervous, makes me trust sarcasm less. Sorry, I'm just being sarcastic.[/QUOTE]
just to be clear, i wasn't being sarcastic at all. i'd like to see all the idealists who are willing get violent based on unrealistic demands lined up and shot. its not how the world works unfortunately. if you can get enough people together on an idea, things will change. but that means its gotta be something that a lot of people agree with. when activists turn to hurting others because not enough people like their ideas or things aren't happening at the pace they would like three things happen. 1) their support weakens. 2) police have to get involved. 3) they seem like whiny bitches. sometimes police will make mistakes. wiping out every last asshole who thinks his ideas are worth killing/hurting people for would not be a mistake, it would be a cleansing. of course that's a contradiction you think i'm fucking stupid?! i'm calm don't worry, just trying to be exciting so i can keep your attention.

i love it. they could drop the ball right on those motherfuckers heads while shooting industrial grade fireworks at them!

:froths at the mouth:

i'm not really a cold blooded killer.

that's the big problem with terrorism we'll never know who the terrorists are. our intelligence services are a bunch of walking oxymorons (not to mention morons teehee) and the common footsoldier is really not equipped to make any sort of decision like whether some ununiformed guy is a combatant or not unless the guy is shooting at him. i think the government is just trying to be proactive. this approach has its ups and downs.

the question: "have the terrorists already won?"

the answer: "a resounding yes."

[QUOTE=mungkay]That's exactly what it was, a theory. I was thinking about it today, and say, IF there was a draft, there could be a LOT of angry people rioting in the streets, and a military presence might be requested.

But again I'm just speculating.[/QUOTE]
oh yeah. rather than protest i'd probably just move to canada though

did you know that the military can actually pull a college student right out of college? if you're selected they say they'll let you finish the current semester then you gotta go... hmm... a semester. just enough time to get some money together and bolt to Canada. got an xtra bed mungkay?

Fuck dude, don't talk about extra beds in Canada. Its a touchy subject there. I didn't mean to imply you were bein sarcastic too. I just that I was being sarcastic about being sarcastic, but it was in print. Note to self: Sarcasm doesn't translate well into print.

Soon it time for bed

hmm... i could sleep on the floor i guess... whaddya say mungkay? i'm kidding of course (unless the answer is yes).

[QUOTE=shpongleyesd]oh yeah. rather than protest i'd probably just move to canada though ;)[/QUOTE]

To get off topic for a bit, I want to slap every fellow Canadian i see who gets together to protest against the war in Iraq. They don't even try to relate Canada to the situation and it looks just like any other protest in the states. I mean what the fuck?

However for all of Canada's faults, at least those crazy peaceniks can make their opinion known. No one has to listen to them of course. Personally I think the greatest insult to democracy is the right to assemble protests. I mean, if we didn't have protest rights, the only other alternative would be to blow shit up to get our point across

I just emailed CNN to ask why letting us know about Martha Stewart's new CEO and Madonna's new childrens book is more important than two tanks driving through downtown Westwood to harrass a group of war protesters. I was looking through some articles, and the national guard and a couple other groups all deny that those were their tanks. (actually, they're not tanks at all, but 'LAV's: Light Armor Vehicles)

I'm sorry, Shpongle, that you had to live through the Cold War, but we're past that now.

Wait, so was that a Police tank, National Guard tank, or a Army tank?

I mean don't you have laws, that staits you can't use the army against your own people? Every democracy should have. I know Finland has.

That's what some movies suggests, mainly [URL=http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0133952/]The Siege[/URL], which is a very good and very scary movie. And everything I've learned from history at school and newspapers says that the movie could be true.

[QUOTE=shpongleyesd]that's what i'm talking about! i just got a chance to read that article. it would have been great if they had just wiped out every last one of those overzealous hippies. its funny how in a riot such as this you only hear about the casualties caused by the authorities who take on the responsibility of stopping it never the casualties that would have been caused by it mushrooming out of control until people are getting trampled or hit with projectiles meant to damage cars or buildings. no matter what the cause, when people protest violently it speaks against the constitution. and the people described in that article were protesting violently. i'll start worrying when unbiased sources start talking about things like this (unbiased this article is not).[/QUOTE]
That's fucked up, man. You're telling me that a bunch of kids with rocks protesting an illegal bombing campaign are going to do more damage than soldiers with fully automatic rifles and the government they support? That is fucked.

[QUOTE=Ioota Rhoo]Wait, so was that a Police tank, National Guard tank, or a Army tank?

I mean don't you have laws, that staits you can't use the army against your own people? Every democracy should have. I know Finland has.

That's what some movies suggests, mainly [URL=http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0133952/]The Siege[/URL], which is a very good and very scary movie. And everything I've learned from history at school and newspapers says that the movie could be true.[/QUOTE]
As far as I know, there are no laws against the government using the military against us. In fact, I think there are certain circumstances where the government can declare marshall law and basically hand the power stick off to one of the military head honchos. The kinda good thing about all this is that we should have the right to form militias to fight back and overthrow the government (the declaration of independence says it's our duty to), but if they start ignoring the constitution and all that, then it's fairly unlikely that they're really going to give a shit about what our rights are.

of all people, Michael Moore seems to think this is a shitty coincidence. i read somewhere that perhaps these tanks were going to be used for a veterans day celebration somewhere. so it actually might make sense if they were driving to their destination, and one idjit tank opperator sees the protesters, and as a joke drives around the block to fuck with them. who knows. makes more sense to me than someone sending tanks out to stop a protest of what looks like 30 people

[QUOTE=atheisticcharlie]I'm sorry, Shpongle, that you had to live through the Cold War, but we're past that now.[/QUOTE]
yes but onto what? this is more of a luke warm war, so i guess there is some adjusting to be done on my part.

tanks don't fuck with 30 unarmed protestors. If even Michael Moore, the king of Bush-Bashing thinks it's a coincidence, then I have to go with him on this one. I like a lot of the points he made in fairenheit 9/11, and I disagreed with some too. I'm sure he'd jump on this if he could, but he hasn't.

so I say blah blah blah blah blah...... America still kicks ass, I'm proud to be American and I [I]would [/I] fight to defend my coutry, if only solely because I live here and I have enjoyed it's freedoms and [B]I'm not a freeloader[/B], so if I'm drafted, you better damn well believe I'll stand tall for my country. If ya'll don't like it, dodge it. But don't ever think I'm gonna piss and moan about the state of our country unless I'm gonna try and do something about it. which I have.

and mungkay, you can just stay on your side of the border, I don't think anyone will mind.

[QUOTE=Rents]That's fucked up, man. You're telling me that a bunch of kids with rocks protesting an illegal bombing campaign are going to do more damage than soldiers with fully automatic rifles and the government they support? That is fucked.[/QUOTE]
i like how people that want to prove a point sneak in key words like 'illegal', etc. i probably do it too. fact is, even if it was illegal (who makes these laws?) that doesn't give anybody the right to start breaking shit and hurting people . that includes military personnel. the military has no place shooting civilians(especially the population that they're supposed to be protecting). i guess i was just expressing my anger with people that think they're so right that they can bring their discussion to 'the next level' and start getting crazy and throwing shit. as i said in an earlier post all that does is create an argument against giving people the right to protest and weakens the position of the people protesting. rioting of this sort might end up being considered a form of or a precursor to terrorism by our government (the guys with the guns). then guess what happens. i think that's what we're all talking about here. the garnishing of free speech. its already happening and has been happening. the question is whether violent protesting is really helping to gain ground in this area. i happen to believe that in the long run it isn't. that's why i get angry and say things like i wish that those soldiers had just wiped out all those fucking hippie brats. because even though they have strong convictions and they may even be right about what they're saying, they're doing the same thing that the soldiers that shot them were doing: getting out of hand.

i know this post is incomplete... i have to get to class... i'll be back for more later.

the only possible reason i could see for the US gov to enact the draft would be if we went to war with syria. this is something i could not see myself agreeing with. sure a lot of the combatants in iraq were syrians with "jihaad" written on their passports but that doesn't mean that they were sent by the syrian government. we all know that syria has been vocally anti american for awhile and a place where anti american extremists can go to get their AK-47s cleaned but there are better less costly ways to force them into submission. i would dodge the draft so fast that even bill clinton's head would be spinning if we went to war with syria and the draft was deemed necessary. certainly if america were being invaded though i would want to fight then. but that scarcely seems like its going to happen.

its unlikely tho because the higher ups in our current military have adopted a doctrine of using a small fast moving force rather than a massive overwhelming force. this is probably in response to this new type of war where combatants are not clearly identifiable and also the anticipated decline in enlistment during war and resistance to the draft.

Syria, Iran, god there's just so many juicy targets out there. Why not round up all the protestors with the help of tanks of course, and draft them? Then they'll have no choice but to support the endless war(it ain't ending anytime soon). what's fucked up about this, is that the country has already resigned itself to the fact that another country will be invaded. Another sovereign nation will be reduced to rubble. People will die. Oh well, what are you gonna do about it? Protest? No fucking way man, there's tanks in the streets.

we could just stop paying taxes. that would end the war. how's that for a tax cut Mr. President? hmmm? how does 100% sound?

Yeah, you think a car is expensive? How about a tank, or an aircraft carrier? It's hard to send tanks to intimidate protestors if there's no tax money to put gas in 'em.