New blood is excited blood

Congratulations on 2K V.P. Oh and very well put together argument on post 1999. I bow before you.

Glad you made it to 2K, I haven't gone to bed yet, been reading some Rand stuff on the internet.

I didn't realize she was so avid about the things I wanted her to be lenient with. Bummer, but I still stand by my own words, just less in her insane defense.

Thank you for talking with me, you make a good point about keeping the good and tossing the bad. I guess youd call that experiencing.

maybe some day ill post on your thread, and you will have to back me a cake because it will be my 2,000th post. a darn good cake at that.

stay gold

Just realized two things

1. this is a "hi im new" post, which is funny concerning how in depth it got...into ayn rand none the less....

2. i meant BAKE a cake, sleepy sleepy slelpylrpd

z time.

[QUOTE=reardensteel]
I didn't realize she was so avid about the things I wanted her to be lenient with. Bummer, but I still stand by my own words, just less in her insane defense.

[/QUOTE]

that was something i had a problem with too. so much stuff seems reasonable at first glance, but alas, ce la vie.

[QUOTE=reardensteel]Just realized two things

1. this is a "hi im new" post, which is funny concerning how in depth it got...into ayn rand none the less....

2. i meant BAKE a cake, sleepy sleepy slelpylrpd

z time.[/QUOTE]

I think it's a great "hi, I'm new thread" Like Ire said, there's been a lack on intelligent conversation lately. It's been all crap and shooting the breeze. Not that that's bad - just --- you know what I mean. It's been fun discussing with you even if we don't agree.

Now back to Ayn Rand,
I have a problem with living by philosophies that fall apart when stretched to the extreme. Yes, we can learn from them - and I think she can teach us some good stuff. But if you really REALLY think about it - What if everyone really DID live with only their own happiness in mind? I think especially when one becomes a parent their own happiness gets shoved to the background for about 18 years while they raise their kids. You want to sleep. Nothing would make you more happy than sleeping. But if you don't get up and feed the baby, it will be miserable the whole night and will get malnourished, etc.. Your own happiness doesn't matter.

People natually look out for themselves and put themselves first. It takes effort to put someone else first. Her theory accentuates selfishness so much that it really turns me off.

Have you ever done something for someone even when you didn't want to - just because you knew they would like it? Even if you knew you wouldn't like doing it? You help someone else out and then realize later, wow - that was great to help that person. But if you are actually looking to feel good from it, you will only see how the other persoin is ungrateful or didn't thank you enough or whatever. Selfless giving can't have double motives. It doesn't work. I've tried both and I can speak form experience on this.

man what a great thread. I've got some catching up to do...

I agree with you on this finally. I see what you are saying about extremes, they are dangerous things.

HOLY SHIT a huge Pileated Woodpecker just perched on the branches outside of my bedroom window. First of the season, awesome. Anyway...

I take what I like and cut the dead weight. I am just saying that sometimes a thick ego and a little monomania is a good thing. I say let people be happy for what they have achieved instead of always needing to thank outside entities. Give respect where respect is due, but take some award yourself. Cut through bullshit with a chainsaw, and never lose sight even if it means stepping on toes. Breaking arms, that sort of thing. It seems like people preach selflessness too much...

Production and morality should be inherently intwined, it is the only hope for the future.

(sin city today!)

[QUOTE=reardensteel]I agree with you on this finally. I see what you are saying about extremes, they are dangerous things.

HOLY SHIT a huge Pileated Woodpecker just perched on the branches outside of my bedroom window. First of the season, awesome. Anyway...

I take what I like and cut the dead weight. I am just saying that sometimes a thick ego and a little monomania is a good thing. I say let people be happy for what they have achieved instead of always needing to thank outside entities. Give respect where respect is due, but take some award yourself. Cut through bullshit with a chainsaw, and never lose sight even if it means stepping on toes. Breaking arms, that sort of thing. It seems like people preach selflessness too much...

Production and morality should be inherently intwined, it is the only hope for the future.

(sin city today!)[/QUOTE]
I think we can all agree on this.

(except for the "cut through the bull shit with a chain saw..." part, cause yuck, what a mess that'd make. )

We should start a new thread for real discussions like this one. Fuck Pointless Anouncements and Random Thoughts... they're fun and all, but usually totally unproductive.

I'm thinking we could structure a topic a week, or maybe one area of discussion a week with topics each day...

thoughts?

Hell yea brother.

Just a free for all debate...words to the soundtrack of Heavy Metal. Mastodon or Slayer.

With all these writers and such we could do something amazing.

(think tank?)

think tank... that's a good term for it I believe.

We should let it brew for a couple days, make sure we get poeple interested in it. I think this is the beginning of something good.

i think a person should always look out for themselves, not out of selfishness, but because they, like everyone else around them, are human beings worthy of respect and the occasional pat on the back for doing a good job at something. Just dont become Russel Crowe and go crazy cuz you cant have your hairdresser.

this thread=annoying.

why?

Because he said so man. Maybe he doesn't like Rand, maybe he does. Maybe he is just being disagreeable. Maybe he thinks people should quit following all these philosophies and come up with their own fucking take on life.

Maybe, just maybe, he didn't mean it at all.

so much over-analyzing that it all blurs together and turns into nonsense. nobody knows anything.

[QUOTE=big S]so much over-analyzing that it all blurs together and turns into nonsense. nobody knows anything.[/QUOTE]

you seem to know you find this thread annoying.

[QUOTE=capitalistnihilist]Because he said so man. Maybe he doesn't like Rand, maybe he does. Maybe he is just being disagreeable. Maybe he thinks people should quit following all these philosophies and come up with their own fucking take on life.

Maybe, just maybe, he didn't mean it at all.[/QUOTE]

nothing new under sun. no way to come up with something new.

I didn't say new sacred, I said your own take on life. Not something you read out of a fucking philosophy book or on [url]www.thephilosophyallthecoolkidsfollow.com[/url]. Doesn't need to be new, it can be a hodge podge of classical bullshit for all I care. But, blindly following another person's philosophy is stupid in my book. Live your life how you see fit. If you want to be a selfish prick that kicks dogs and steals candy from kids- good for you. If you want to be the nicest most caring, giving person in the world, thats cool too.

I think the newbie has it right though- take it in, analyze it, then cut out the bullshit you don't like.

Oh, and if you think there is nothing new under the sun, you are sorely mistaken. People are coming up with new shit all the time.

that link is broken.

just kidding.

the first bit about picking and choosing is what everyone does, as reardensteel was saying about cutting out the bullshit. Even the people who wrote the books or the webmasters at [url]www.thephilosophyallthecoolkidsfollow.com[/url] do that. which is why i say nothing new under the sun. Its all variation on a theme. a postmodern hodgepodge if you will.

btw - the link is broken

Drat, that would be a cool website though- if only to host it and eventually control the planet.

Sorry the thread I started annoys you....?
I guess...?

No, Im not. I didn't mean to lie like that. Sure anyone can say that the ultimate outcome of a disagreement is a disagreement, big whop. You topped us all! yay!

The fun part is debating. Let us talk, take part or don't. Discussion keeps us healthy.

And also, I'll follow whatever philosophy I find appealing k?

ok cool.
(cut the bullshit)

No, rearden, you follow the philosophy we tell you to. Its a cult remember?

[QUOTE=reardensteel]Sorry the thread I started annoys you....?
I guess...?

No, Im not. I didn't mean to lie like that. Sure anyone can say that the ultimate outcome of a disagreement is a disagreement, big whop. You topped us all! yay!

The fun part is debating. Let us talk, take part or don't. Discussion keeps us healthy.

And also, I'll follow whatever philosophy I find appealing k?

ok cool.
(cut the bullshit)[/QUOTE]

fuckin A

the only thing i ever liked about ayn rand was that she spells her name the same way as the hebrew word for emptiness or limitless, like in ain suph aur. and that "ari", the ayn rand institute, is a hebrew word that means "enlightened one" (lion is a metaphor).

such pretension!

Ayn Rand, Ann Coulter, Martha Stewart: If only they'd been diagnosed before they found public forums. That was a joke. I think Rand sparks such remarkable debates because she is a sort of manifestation of the shadow self we all carry around, that secret sense of our vast superiority to all other specimens of human beings. It is an inherent danger in a monotheistic culture. No matter what your religion, believing in a single, sentient Godhead who listens to you individually, and wants things from you individually, can set up a dangerous confusion of scale. Especially those who follow the New Testament Deity. You know these folks: the "I talk to God and He tells me what to do." Um, like start wars? To these folks (and there are many here where I live), I want to ask if they've seen any of the photos taken by the Hubble telescope and if so, do those vast and magnificant images look like the work of a creator who cares who you sleep with? Or is against mind altering substances?

Wandered off Topic--sorry. Rand is a catalyst because her philosophies have a seductive quality; we recognize both the appeal and the danger of her partiuclar madness. Readers love her or hate her with equal rabidity. This thread has been one of the more level-headed nonscreaming match debates over Ms. Ayn that I've witnessed. In the end: Girlfriend could write, but girfriend was insane.

And now the music portion of our program. My personal anthem.

Jill Sobule's "Heroes"

[SIZE=2]Why are all our heroes so imperfect
Why do they always bring me down
Why are all our heroes so imperfect
The statue in the park has lost his crown

William Faulkner drunk and depressed
Dorothy Parker mean, drunk and depressed
And that guy in Seven Years in Tibet turned out to be a nazi
The founding fathers all had slaves,
The explorers slaughtered the braves,
The Old Testament God can be so petty

Paul McCartney jealous of John, even more so now that he's gone
Dylan was so mean to Donovan in that movie
Pablo Picasso cruel to his wives
My favorite poets took their own lives
Orson Welles peaked at 25, ballooned before our eyes
and he sold bad wine

Heard Babe Ruth was full of malice
Lewis Carroll I'm sure did Alice
Plato in the cave with those very young boys
TS Elliott hated Jews, FDR didn't save the Jews
All the French joined the resistance after the war
Raymond Chandler drunk and depressed
Tennessee Williams drunk and depressed
Think I'll just get drunk and depressed. [/SIZE]