black swan = the wrestler?
ok, so i saw black swan tonight, and i left feeling like it was a little too similar to the wrestler, as far as the way things play out. and even had a lot of the same camera work.
i mean i understand that the movie is a re-imagining swan lake, and thats fine, but it doesnt change that there are parallels.
anyone else see this?
www.triplebeard.com
http://darkroomreview.blogspot.com
“...There are so many ways of being despicable it quite makes one's head spin. But the way to be really despicable is to be contemptuous of other people's pain. You ought to have some apprehension that the man you see before you was once even younger than you are now and arrived at his present wretchedness by imperceptible degrees.”
-James Baldwin
I'm just glad to hear that it's actually come out somewhere.
oh yeah. Who did the music? Did he get Clint Mansell back?
its not a bad movie, and if you watch it just for its modernized, somewhat psychological thriller vision of swan lake you will probably enjoy it.
portman carries the movie nicely, and it might be her best role.
like i said though, its similarity to THE WRESTLER bugs me, and i was informed that was intentional, which i think bugs me more. the link below was furnished to me by someone on the velvet.
read at your own risk, spoilers possible
http://moviesblog.mtv.com/2010/08/30/black-swan-the-wrestler-darren-aron...
www.triplebeard.com
http://darkroomreview.blogspot.com
“...There are so many ways of being despicable it quite makes one's head spin. But the way to be really despicable is to be contemptuous of other people's pain. You ought to have some apprehension that the man you see before you was once even younger than you are now and arrived at his present wretchedness by imperceptible degrees.”
-James Baldwin
I don't know if I'm going to like a Wrestler version of Robocop.
Yeah.
Darren Aronofsky directed both The Wrestler and Black Swan so theirs bond to be similarities. Also if you came in excepting it to be close to The Wrestler, it's going to be close to The Wrestler. And Nate he's no longer attached to the Robocop reboot, he's doing the Wolverine sequel.
"The rat inside your brain rules the world."
Citizen Kane SUCKED!!!!!!! True fact.
Alcoholism is the cure not the disease.
i went in there, though, knowing nothing about this movie. it only hit my radar a couple days ago, and my fiance wanted to see it. it's been a terrible movie year, so i agreed, pretty much so i could get out of the house.
before the credits rolled, i thought wow its almost like THE WRESTLER with a revised script. and then... yeah.. and then i knew the same person made both of them. its not like i went in there jaded, or even expecting one of his movies.
www.triplebeard.com
http://darkroomreview.blogspot.com
“...There are so many ways of being despicable it quite makes one's head spin. But the way to be really despicable is to be contemptuous of other people's pain. You ought to have some apprehension that the man you see before you was once even younger than you are now and arrived at his present wretchedness by imperceptible degrees.”
-James Baldwin
Yeah.
I'm sold. I don't care if this is just him doing a short for shot remake of Ishtar. Mansell doing the music and I'm there.
Yeah.
I haven't seen the film, but I've been listening to the soundtrack and it's amazing. Though I wouldn't expect anything less from Mansell.
To me the only similarity it has with The Wrestler is that both films are ultimately about fringe performance arts. Having read the comments by Aronofsky in the article you linked, I think it actually makes perfect sense to look at these movies as companion pieces. In a lot of way that makes a ton of sense and though Black Swan is fresh in my head, I think it makes me like Black Swan even more.
I didn't know a ton about this one, as I normally avoid info about Aronofsky's films before I see them. I knew it was about Swan Lake and that was basically it. I had ideas in my head of where he was going to probably take that and I don't think I was even close.
The 3rd act of Black Swan was insanely awesome to me. I don't want to spoil it for anyone else so I'll end it at that.
But saying it is "The Wrestler with a revised script" couldn't be any farther from the truth. That's like saying Apocalypse Now and Platoon are basically the same movie because they're both about Vietnam.
Also Mansell's score is of course, amazing. But you'll have even more respect for it after seeing the film.
this shit isn't out anywhere near here yet! This is messed up!
It's being boycotted by theaters up here. Don't know why.
they finally come out with a flick that I actually want to give them my money for rather than just stealing it and they don't have it anywhere near here. Stupid fuckin' irony!
I really want to see it! I'll try to tape if for you with my phone, Nate!
Also, is it still good if you've never seen Swan Lake?
I actually didn't finish watching 'The Wrestler', I couldn't take the main character seriously at all. I'm sure it's because I think that kind of wrestling is ridiculous.
I wonder if you could sit there in a theater with a phone and just call someone up so they can watch it live, just holding the phone up to the screen? You wouldn't be recording it or anything like that. should be able to get away with it.
I'm sure I'd drop the phone during the scary parts.
just as long as I can see the parts where portman's making out with the other chick.
It's still on limited release. Fox is rolling it out to more theaters each week. It was only on 17 screens last weekend. I think they pumped that up to somewhere around 75 this weekend.
You're totally missing out.
And yes, it is ridiculous. But the character is grounded in a lot of reality of what those guys go through. Most pro-wrestlers don't seem to make it out of their 50's.
On top of that, they don't even make that much money. The dudes in the WWE, for instance, do it with the hope that they can become the next Hulk or they can move into movies. The WWE doesn't even pay for their travel expenses to go from fight to fight.
I've seen some messed up things in my time, but when he rams his thumb into the thing, I still can not watch that. I have to turn away when it's at that part.
You're totally missing out.
And yes, it is ridiculous. But the character is grounded in a lot of reality of what those guys go through. Most pro-wrestlers don't seem to make it out of their 50's.
On top of that, they don't even make that much money. The dudes in the WWE, for instance, do it with the hope that they can become the next Hulk or they can move into movies. The WWE doesn't even pay for their travel expenses to go from fight to fight.
SPOILERS BELOW!!
I watched it up to the point he has a heart attack and I still wasn't interested in his character. When he blows off his daughter and bursts in her home to apologize is when I stopped watching. I'm pretty sure I'm not missing out on anything. There are plenty of films about marginalized people that do a better job of eliciting my empathy and interest.
Yeah, I think it might have helped if you had finished it. You're missing out on some stuff that I think is important to the story by killing it early. Particularly that though the movie makes you think it is going to be a tale of redemption, it isn't at all. In fact, I don't think you are supposed to have empathy for him at all.
***SPOILER ALERT****
First, let me state that I'm not an Aronofsky apologist... I do think Requiem for a Dream is a memorable work of art, and even his first effort Pi was worth viewing.
But I did NOT like The Wrestler at all... and I thought The Fountain was also a major disappointment as it could have been a good movie, but instead he lost the story for the sake of the visuals.
With all that said, I really enjoyed Black Swan. It's not the most original concept, but it's well crafted and well acted... and it has some serious Aronofsky mind-trips to keep people guessing. It felt like he found more of a balance here than with some of his other movies.
As was mentioned earlier, Aronofsky discussed the parallel between The Wrestler and Black Swan... and that originally they began as one movie, but he eventually split them into two projects. The connection is obvious... they are both 'performers' and their work takes a physical and mental toll on all those involved. Yet, while ballet is considered one of the highest forms of 'performance art', wrestling is often scoffed at as being one of the lowest forms of entertainment. But for the athletes involved, the practice and the training, the pain and the dedication... it's very similar between them both. Aronofsky found this paradox interesting.
In one interview, he was quoted as saying he hopes an 'art house movie theater will show them as a double bill'.
The bottom line is simply this... Regardless of your feelings about Aronofsky's past movies, I would recommend seeing Black Swan... but definitely go into it with an open mind and with as little information or clues as possible. It's both familiar, yet unique... and in the end, it was entertaining, which is all we can really ask for.
****DOUBLE SPOILER ALERT**** I'm WARNING YOU**
****UNLESS YOU SAW THE MOVIE, STOP READING***
As an interesting side point, while leaving Black Swan, my wife said "It's like Fight Club for women". The 'double personality' taking control of the main character, how she had to 'kill' one side of herself to free the other half, the overall trippy feel of the movie... I guess I can see what she meant. Any thoughts from those who've seen Black Swan yet on that topic?
"Staring at a blank page and trying write the best thing ever is a guaranteed way make sure the page stays blank." - Trent Reznor
The truth is I found it incredibly boring. I didn't care enough to want to see what happens. I only just now looked it up on wiki after reading your post. After reading about the end, I'm especially glad I didn't watch any more! (Maybe they pull it off somehow, but the end seems silly to me).
MORE SPOILERS!!!
From the amount I saw, I do believe we were supposed to feel empathy for the main character. His rapport with the kids (when he's sleeping in his car after being locked out of his trailer), him standing up for the stripper when the guys are mocking her for her age, the first time he works the deli counter, all those scenes are to show what a good guy he is. That and having a boss that demeans him are all efforts to make him into a hero that the little guy can relate to and I found it overtly manipulative and not effective.
I'm still very excited to see Black Swan!
haha the whole fight club for chicks angle.
i knew that would come up. i even went on rotten tomatoes when i got back from seeing it to see if the select city crowd had that same thought. i think i saw one. in the end, though... i mean all things considered, i dont think so. it isnt even discussed as to whether or not she has an alternate personality, or she just imagined all that crap with the mila kunis character.
she might be paranoid, maybe delusional, she may even hallucinate, but i dont think shes tyler durden.
www.triplebeard.com
http://darkroomreview.blogspot.com
“...There are so many ways of being despicable it quite makes one's head spin. But the way to be really despicable is to be contemptuous of other people's pain. You ought to have some apprehension that the man you see before you was once even younger than you are now and arrived at his present wretchedness by imperceptible degrees.”
-James Baldwin
We saw it in Atlanta this weekend. I loved it, my fiance thought it was meh. I think Portman is going to get an Oscar nod, and she'll deserve it.
If she doesn't the academy is full of retards.
The Academy is already full retards last time I checked.
"The rat inside your brain rules the world."
Citizen Kane SUCKED!!!!!!! True fact.
Alcoholism is the cure not the disease.
Are you saying all retards are gay? You should be ashamed of yourself!
Are you saying all retards are gay? You should be ashamed of yourself!
I honestly have no clue how you got to this conclusion. But I'm hardly surprised.
"The rat inside your brain rules the world."
Citizen Kane SUCKED!!!!!!! True fact.
Alcoholism is the cure not the disease.
you the one said hollywood was full of retards, not me.
I said the Academy is full of retards, not Hollywood. Besides no one makes movies in Hollywood anymore, it's all in Vancouver.
"The rat inside your brain rules the world."
Citizen Kane SUCKED!!!!!!! True fact.
Alcoholism is the cure not the disease.
Whoa.
I think it's going to take me 6 months to analyse and decipher what I just saw.
Last I checked Louisiana was the new Vancouver.
Actually if anything Montreal is the new Vancouver, there's a battle between BC and Quebec to offer the bigger tax break, But Quebec has a lot of French architecture and doesn't have any pre-existent sets or crew Vancouver has available. Toronto is trying to regain its former glory but the CN Tower makes it difficult to feature the skyline in a shot since it's fairly recognizable, letting Hamilton steal all the business since Hamilton is anytown, anywhere. The tax breaks in Quebec and Ontario still only relate to film not TV. Besides last time I New Mexico more than any other place in America is getting more films and TV and I haven't heard I thing about their being any thing even remotely resembling a film industry in Louisiana excluding New Orleans. But the only thing filmed in New Orleans are based in New Orleans, its impossible for it to look like any other city out there making it impossible for it to be Vancouver. In summary the only true competition to Vancouver is Hamilton, even with the recent tax breaks and the ones promised in the future is still no where close to Quebec or BC.
"The rat inside your brain rules the world."
Citizen Kane SUCKED!!!!!!! True fact.
Alcoholism is the cure not the disease.
Not to keep following the Black Swan = The Wrestler thing, but did anyone else notice that the climatic shots for both films are, you know, IDENTICAL!
Then I guess you haven't been listening. The film industry is pretty big both in New Orleans and here. There are enough films being shot here to keep many of my friends employed full time.
I'm bad at keeping up with what is filmed here, but some of the bigger names over the past few years have been The Guardian, Mr. Brooks, and Harold and Kumar 2. I never pay attention to what is being filmed in NOLA, but I assure you they aren't all based there. Actually, The Guardian was originally being shot there until Katrina forced them to move up here.
"I'm glad I live in the GPS era. In a different century, I would've set off to visit the other side of the village and wandered off into the mountains and been eaten by a carnivorous plant. Or discovered the Americas."
-LaJessica
Some more to add:
Curious Case of Benjamin Button
The Mechanic remake
Twilight: Breaking Dawn
Bug
Battle: Los Angeles
Jonah Hex
Straw Dogs remake
Bad Lt: Port of Call New Orleans (duh)
W.
The Road
Drive Angry
Cirque du Freak
Green Lantern
The Expendables
The Last Exorcism
Deja Vu
There's also a shitload of other films in development.
Curious Case of Benjamin Button
The Mechanic remake
Twilight: Breaking Dawn
Bug
Battle: Los Angeles
Jonah Hex
Straw Dogs remake
Bad Lt: Port of Call New Orleans (duh)
W.
The Road
Drive Angry
Cirque du Freak
Green Lantern
The Expendables
The Last Exorcism
Deja Vu
There's also a shitload of other films in development.
oh yeah, and those.
"I'm glad I live in the GPS era. In a different century, I would've set off to visit the other side of the village and wandered off into the mountains and been eaten by a carnivorous plant. Or discovered the Americas."
-LaJessica
Can someone explain how she was able to do the big black swan dance and then the whole finale dance with the thing in her thing without any trouble till the very end?
I asked the same question. maybe something to do with a psychotic break and a surge of adrenaline?
"I'm glad I live in the GPS era. In a different century, I would've set off to visit the other side of the village and wandered off into the mountains and been eaten by a carnivorous plant. Or discovered the Americas."
-LaJessica
I can see that, but it doesn't make sense why she wouldn't be bleeding the whole time either.
Then again maybe it's something to do with us seeing things that did and didn't happen all the way through the movie.
I'm still not exactly sure what all is supposed to have really happened.
Then again maybe it's something to do with us seeing things that did and didn't happen all the way through the movie.
I'm still not exactly sure what all is supposed to have really happened.
yeah, i'm with you on that.
"I'm glad I live in the GPS era. In a different century, I would've set off to visit the other side of the village and wandered off into the mountains and been eaten by a carnivorous plant. Or discovered the Americas."
-LaJessica
What's crazy is i usually hate movies like that but I really enjoyed Black Swan.
I just need to watch it about 6 more times to find out why I like it.
Curious Case of Benjamin Button
The Mechanic remake
Twilight: Breaking Dawn
Bug
Battle: Los Angeles
Jonah Hex
Straw Dogs remake
Bad Lt: Port of Call New Orleans (duh)
W.
The Road
Drive Angry
Cirque du Freak
Green Lantern
The Expendables
The Last Exorcism
Deja Vu
There's also a shitload of other films in development.
I can't speak for all of these but what's up with that Twilight series, it went form Oregon to Vancouver and now apparently to Louisiana, they had all the sets built up in Vancouver, so to do another location change doesn't seem economical. Battle: Los Angels was filmed in Los Angels for the most part, I think only the really technical stuff wasn't, which could be most of the film for all I know. I don't even think there filming the Straw Dogs remake yet, so the location could change. I thought The Road and Drive Angry was filmed in Michigan, but I'm not sure. Last but not lest I remember hearing the Green Lantern was filmed in Australia.
"The rat inside your brain rules the world."
Citizen Kane SUCKED!!!!!!! True fact.
Alcoholism is the cure not the disease.
You people are nuts!
*SPOILERS*
Black Swan is about a girl discovering a different side of herself for the sake of her art, exploring it and finding that the psychological toll she puts on herself for ballet is simply way too much, but to her it's worth it for the perfection that she seeks.
The Wrestler is about a washed up has-been who fucked up what really mattered in his life for glory, but realized that that glory wasn't forever, so he tries to regain a little bit of that life he could've had, but is spurned by fate and tries to make the glory he already has eternal.
These are two completely different movies that happen to have suicidal performance artists. I see no other similarities, not even in their messages. Oh, and you're ABSOLUTELY supposed to sympathize/empathize with Randy the Ram. If you can't, then whatever. Not your kinda movie/Not your kind of character.
/*SPOILERS*
Si vis pacem, para bellum
I haven't seen either film but a reimagining of Swan Lake would interest me. Is this so? Should I consider seeing it for that alone?
This is why we can't have nice things.