Cormac McCarthy

[QUOTE=bearchaser;1041260]anybody ever read any of his work?

I recently bought [I]Blood Meridian [/I]and may get [I]No Country For Old Men[/I].[/QUOTE]

Yes, I'm a big fan. I've read the[I] Border Trilogy[/I], [I]Blood Meridian[/I],[I] No Country For Old Men[/I] and [I]The Road[/I]. The last three all tie for first place for me. I enjoyed the prose in the three volumes of [I]The Border Trilogy[/I], but they didn't hook me like the other three I've read.

If you don't get into[I] Blood Meridian[/I], set it aside and get [I]No Country For Old Men[/I] and return to [I]Blood [/I]at a later time. Though now, the more I think about it, the more I hope you read that one first.

I plan on reading [I]Blood Meridian [/I]after I finish the two or three books Im in the middle of at the moment. Ive never been into westerns but I heard this one wasnt like any other. more like that film [I]The Preposition[/I].

I'm not familiar with the film, but yes, it's not like a "Western" at all. Out of the 4 of 5siblings that read it in my family, 3 (including me) rate it as one of their top 5 faves. The other hated it. One of my brothers only reads non fiction and he read and loved it. So who knows.

I was just about to start a thread on Blood Meridian. I finished it last night.

Basically what I was going to say was:

I read it because of that BR Myers article about American lit being pretentious, and I wanted to read more of Blood Meridian than just the bad examples that Myers gave.

Now, after reading it, I have to agree with Myers about many things, including the pointlessness of McCarthy's pseudo-biblical style, which really doesn't make it as epic as McCarthy probably intended. The constant and-and-and-and-and sometimes worked beautifully, and sometimes failed totally.

However, I enjoyed the book quite a bit. Especially how you very, very rarely get to know what's going on inside the kid's head. That was refreshing. The Judge is a scary fucker, too.

It's too bad those little idiosyncratic touches, like the "andelope," failed to enhance the prose, because it's a worthwhile book.

what got me into him was seeing the trailer for [I]No Country For Old Men[/I].

It just seemed like something I would like.

I mean, a guy killing people with a cattle gun seems genius to me.

[QUOTE=xec8;1041315]I was just about to start a thread on Blood Meridian. I finished it last night.

Basically what I was going to say was:

I read it because of that BR Myers article about American lit being pretentious, and I wanted to read more of Blood Meridian than just the bad examples that Myers gave.

Now, after reading it, I have to agree with Myers about many things, including the pointlessness of McCarthy's pseudo-biblical style, which really doesn't make it as epic as McCarthy probably intended. The constant and-and-and-and-and sometimes worked beautifully, and sometimes failed totally.

However, I enjoyed the book quite a bit. Especially how you very, very rarely get to know what's going on inside the kid's head. That was refreshing. The Judge is a scary fucker, too.

It's too bad those little idiosyncratic touches, like the "andelope," failed to enhance the prose, because it's a worthwhile book.[/QUOTE]

I disagree with both you (and I guess Myers..haven't heard of him) because I think it's a perfect novel. I don't see the pointlessness of the "pseudo-biblical" style, it is exactly the right style for the story he is telling. But, I feel very connected to the story. I think it is epic. And I certainly hope that it is everything that Mr. McCarthy intended it to be to his own satisfaction.

[QUOTE=mirka;1041344]I disagree with both you (and I guess Myers..haven't heard of him) because I think it's a perfect novel. I don't see the pointlessness of the "pseudo-biblical" style, it is exactly the right style for the story he is telling. But, I feel very connected to the story. I think it is epic. And I certainly hope that it is everything that Mr. McCarthy intended it to be to his own satisfaction.[/QUOTE]
It'd be silly to try to change your mind, but I will say that I didn't mean to imply that the [I]novel [/I]isn't epic. It certainly is. Just that the faux-biblical prose didn't make the novel seem [I]more [/I]epic, which (or so it felt as I was reading it) was partly the reason for using a biblical voice in the first place. That particular feature of the writing smacked of a pompousness which McCarthy could and should have avoided, because it doesn't do the novel justice.

[QUOTE=xec8;1041358]It'd be silly to try to change your mind, but I will say that I didn't mean to imply that the [I]novel [/I]isn't epic. It certainly is. Just that the faux-biblical prose didn't make the novel seem [I]more [/I]epic, which (or so it felt as I was reading it) was partly the reason for using a biblical voice in the first place. That particular feature of the writing smacked of a pompousness which McCarthy could and should have avoided, because it doesn't do the novel justice.[/QUOTE]

No, you won't change my mind. Because what I liked about the book is exactly what you insist makes it pompous. McCarthy's careful rendering of idiom and the consistancy and expertise in pulling off that 'biblical' tone is what makes it a marvel to me.

How pompous it is of you to say what McCarthy "could and should have avoided". His writing doesn't do the novel justice? What kind of crap is that? Maybe you as a reader and critic, don't do the novel justice.

[QUOTE=mirka;1041371]No, you won't change my mind. Because what I liked about the book is exactly what you insist makes it pompous. McCarthy's careful rendering of idiom and the consistancy and expertise in pulling off that 'biblical' tone is what makes it a marvel to me.

How pompous it is of you to say what McCarthy "could and should have avoided". His writing doesn't do the novel justice? What kind of crap is that? Maybe you as a reader and critic, don't do the novel justice.[/QUOTE]
Is that a reasonable reaction?

Calling the novel "perfect" is just as ludicrous as me saying what McCarthy --- sorry, [I]Mister [/I]McCarthy --- should've done. Don't act like you thought I was making a final statement about the merits of McCarthy's craftsmanship. I didn't even say his writing failed to do the novel justice, only that the phony biblical style failed. If you disagree, the more power to you, but it's hardly pompous of me to explain, in a moderate tone, what I thought was wrong with the novel... and why I didn't enjoy it as much as you.

[QUOTE=xec8;1041372]Is that a reasonable reaction?

Calling the novel "perfect" is just as ludicrous as me saying what McCarthy --- sorry, [I]Mister [/I]McCarthy --- should've done. Don't act like you thought I was making a final statement about the merits of McCarthy's craftsmanship. I didn't even say his writing failed to do the novel justice, only that the phony biblical style failed. If you disagree, the more power to you, but it's hardly pompous of me to explain, in a moderate tone, what I thought was wrong with the novel... and why I didn't enjoy it as much as you.[/QUOTE]

That's my opinion, not a reaction. So don't insult me.

I think it is a perfect novel. I said why I think it's perfect.. You say that he could and should have written it differently. I say that's pompous. Like I said in my previous statement, you did not present it as what failed [I]for you[/I], but what mcCarthy should have done differently to do his [I]own [/I]novel justice.

I'm not acting like you were making a statement about all of his work, just this novel. So where that came from on your part, I have no idea.

And when when I give [I]my [/I]opinion, I'm called pompous. So very sorry about insulting you. Never mind, I've got other books to read. I'm glad you enjoyed Blood Meridian, since I did too.

All I've read by him is [I]The Road[/I]- it's the most recent book I've finished, actually. I found it stunningly beautiful - I found myself re-reading some sentences half a dozen times. I immediately went out and picked up [I]Blood Meridian[/I] though I've yet to start it - I've got a few dozen books in the to-read pile. I did, however, read the first page... and can't wait to find the time to devour the book in its entirety. Everything from the tight minimalist style - 'Night of your birth. Thirty-three.' or 'God how the stars did fall.' to his thicker, almost circular sentence structure - 'The mother dead these fourteen years did incubate in her own bosom the creature who would carry her off.' hit me hard, made me want more. I'm quite glad I've never read his work before, because that means I have that much more to read in front of me.

-kristopher

Ive read the Road and straightaway bought No Country For Old Men. I cant get hold of a copy of Blood Meridian anywhere. I really enjoyed The Road so I will read NCFOM soon and post my thoughts.

[QUOTE=bearchaser;1041316]I mean, a guy killing people with a cattle gun seems genius to me.[/QUOTE]

Rent [URL=http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0446719/]Isolation[/URL] someday. It's heavily derivative of Alien, and it's certainly flawed (the creature, for example, is blatantly low budget), but there's enough going for it that the film deserves attention. If you'd like to see a maniac wielding a cattle gun or always wondered what would happen if a facehugger came across bovine prey, then it's for you. Be warned, there's a lot of violence directed towards cows (especially early on) that can be a bit disturbing.

kristopher

[QUOTE=Barca Boy;1041501]Ive read the Road and straightaway bought No Country For Old Men. I cant get hold of a copy of Blood Meridian anywhere. I really enjoyed The Road so I will read NCFOM soon and post my thoughts.[/QUOTE]
Look out for [I]Blood Meridian[/I] in the shops. I couldn't find it for a while but it's been reprinted in the same style cover as [I]The Road[/I]:
[URL]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Blood-Meridian-Evening-Redness-Picador/dp/0330312561/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/202-5367325-5487068?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1190476716&sr=8-1[/URL]
£5.99! Don't know what that is in Euros.

£5.99? I got my copy of NCFOM for £7.99 in Waterstones. Eurgh!

Also: lols at Mirka and Phil arguing. Though Mirka does seem to have a habit of delving into name calling a lot.

I don't know how much my copy of [I]Blood Meridian[/I] cost but it was in the buy one get one half-price offer at Borders. I bought it with this:
[IMG]http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/51CK%2B%2BsvACL._AA240_.jpg[/IMG]
From the author of the number one best-selling [I]Gossip Girl[/I] series.

Borders is out of my way. I just go from the Trainstation to Notre Dame, I'm don't walk to the mainstreet. I should have really gone there. Bah.

I haven't been able to get into The Road, tired a couple times and probably will again.

Because...when Cormac works he works so well.

Blood Merridian had its problems, I got bogged down in the latter third or so of it, but overall I enjoyed it. I was totally hooked by the scene in the beginning where the guy gets a stranger lynched just for the hell of it. I also admit I dropped the book and laughed until I cried when Sproul tells the Kid that he came out West for his health (for the uninitiated, the character is wandering in the dessert with a gangrenous arm after being one of the few soldiers to survive an Apache raid).

I also like how McCarthy gives his villains their say. 'Wolves cull their own, who else could?' as a rationalization for genocide, in the Blood Merridian example.

I enjoyed the border trilogy, too. Things like a 17 year old kid getting a wild hair to take a wolf back to Mexico and set it free, I love that. And the adolescent protagonists in those stories give you the fresh eyes of an innocent to see the world with.

But my favorite so far, by far, is No Country for Old Men. I've read it twice and listened to it three or four times (read by Tom Stechschulte) and I love it every time. Chigurh is maybe the best übervillains ever created. And the jackpot Moss finds, what would anyone do faced with the chance to walk off with $2.4 million? You'd have to make the run for it, right?

See, I wasn't even intending to start this book for ages but I took a sneak peek earlier and already I'm on 78, and shit this is a great novel, and yeah Chix, 100% already I'm thinking Chiggy is an awesomely bad motherfucker. Also, after watching the trailer, the name Llewlyn sounds awesome whenever I read it.

I think I devoured The Road in a matter of days, it wasn't a "Oh, time to read." novel, it was a "Oh, I'll get dinner later." novel. I loved it, it was really brilliant stuff. McCarthy is definitely a very enjoyable writer. I'm definitely looking to get into Blood Meridian, All the Pretty Horses and the border trilogy too. Thank God this guy's written more than a few novels, which I personally think is a lot of my favourite author's downfall.

[QUOTE=corellion;1041897]Also, after watching the trailer, the name Llewlyn sounds awesome whenever I read it.
[/QUOTE]

Until you said that, I didn't know it was being made into a movie.

That does look awesome. Looks like they stayed faithful to the book (at least everything in the trailer is int he book).

Except when the Sheriff says 'He seen the same things I seen and it made a impression on me.' (page 94 in the hardback) It makes a difference to my ear, 'a' versus 'an.' Which is McCarthy, he's got a fantastic ear for dialect. Has to, since he refused to use quotation marks and relies on the reader to figure out what's exposition and what's spoken between characters (and mostly, even, who said what).

I don't feel like reading this whole thread, so apologies if I'm repeating, but...

I've read [I]The Road[/I]...I was highly skeptical, because it was an Oprah's Book Club book and I can't stand Oprah...but it was an outstanding book. That's really all I feel like saying.

[QUOTE=tom9d;1042566]I don't feel like reading this whole thread, so apologies if I'm repeating, but...

I've read [I]The Road[/I]...I was highly skeptical, because it was an Oprah's Book Club book and I can't stand Oprah...but it was an outstanding book. That's really all I feel like saying.[/QUOTE]

No, you have to say more.

But seriously, Oprah's list isn't necessarily a bad one. The Bluest Eye, maybe my favorite Tony Morrison novel, was an Oprah Club selection. The Lovely Bones, while not on the level of Morrison or McCarthy was good chick lit. And I think the club has also endorsed some classics, Steinbeck, Faulkner that sort of thing.

[QUOTE=Chixulub;1041904]Except when the Sheriff says 'He seen the same things I seen and it made a impression on me.' (page 94 in the hardback) It makes a difference to my ear, 'a' versus 'an.' Which is McCarthy, he's got a fantastic ear for dialect. Has to, since he refused to use quotation marks and relies on the reader to figure out what's exposition and what's spoken between characters (and mostly, even, who said what).[/QUOTE]

I've made a thread about the film to try and bump up some more awareness of it, it really looks like a fantastic film. And yeah, the "a" rather than "an" is a great touch. Also, I like how he works his dialogue, similar to Baer really, where when he wants you wondering if something was a thought, if it was dialogue, if it was narration - he'll have you wondering it, and if he doesn't then you just need to go and read the last attribution. I'm really enjoying the little speeches at the start of chapters too, they're pretty awesome.

I thought the casting was great and the actor playing Chigurh really manages to pull off the weird, almost exotic, menace.

[QUOTE=Chixulub;1042573]No, you have to say more.

But seriously, Oprah's list isn't necessarily a bad one. The Bluest Eye, maybe my favorite Tony Morrison novel, was an Oprah Club selection. The Lovely Bones, while not on the level of Morrison or McCarthy was good chick lit. And I think the club has also endorsed some classics, Steinbeck, Faulkner that sort of thing.[/QUOTE]

The Road was fantastic, and though I did peel my Oprah sticker off as soon as I could, (Yeah, she's even infected Britain) it was a great novel and I really enjoyed reading it. I mean, if it takes Oprah to get someone into reading, then awesome. I think it's cool she's doing a book-club thing and sticking on a couple of good books as well as Danielle Steel or whatever.

ncfom..

[youtube]YBqmKSAHc6w[/youtube]
[youtube]kiEKc5gOftc[/youtube]
[youtube]lPd8jIuAR74&mode=related&search=[/youtube]

a few trailers i enjoyed.

-kabol

As soon as I finish Confederancy of Dunces and Heartsick Im reading NCFOM.

I'm almost finished it. I think I'm going to go and read it for an hour or somethign and finish it. It was a fantastic novel, I would actually, say it was one of the best I've ever read. I've got through it quickly, it's been great. He's just departed from the hitchiking girl, for the first time, in case they meet again. I'm expecting someone important and innocent to die. It just seems like that's what McCarthy'll do.

[QUOTE=Chixulub;1042573]No, you have to say more.
.[/QUOTE]

I CAN HAS CHEEZBURGER?

[font=tahoma]i [i]love[/i] cheeze.[/font]

.

Just finished it. Brilliant, I loved it. Sort of dark ending, mind, but fair in a way. I really enjoyed it. I think it's safe to say Mr. McCarthy is one of my favourite authors. I want to read more now. If it wasn't for the cult my life, in a writing/literature sense, would be so much duller.

I read The Road to see what all the hullabaloo was about and it stunk. Nothing but page after page of him telling us how grey and ashen and leaden everything is. There were a couple of good scenes in there but overall a snoozer.
Completely turned me off of bothering to check out any of his other work. There's just too much other stuff out there to check out to give him a second chance right now.

I wasn't bowled over by [I]The Road[/I] either; I couldn't wait for it to end in fact! But people (good peoples) have touted [I]Blood Meridian[/I] as a right rollicking read and shit, I don't have anything better to do...

[QUOTE=corellion;1043653] I'm expecting someone important and innocent to die. It just seems like that's what McCarthy'll do.[/QUOTE]

You can bank on it, in my experience. McCarthy will think of the worst thing that could happen to the character you're pulling for and then come up with something worse.

[QUOTE=corellion;1043858]Just finished it. Brilliant, I loved it. Sort of dark ending, mind, but fair in a way. I really enjoyed it. I think it's safe to say Mr. McCarthy is one of my favourite authors. I want to read more now. If it wasn't for the cult my life, in a writing/literature sense, would be so much duller.[/QUOTE]

Dark ending...ya think? Yes, but McCarthy doesn't really do happy ones. I suppose the Border Trilogy books, they're not uniformly unhappy endings, but the protagonists pay terrible prices, and good characters lose and die in those books.

But this book, to me, this justifies the whole career. A lot of the Border Trilogy is very dry exposition:[I] he dowsed the coals and set his horse and went to an arroyo. Then another aroyo.[/I] Then he made camp. I"m exaggerating, but I lose patience with that shit sometimes.

This book, the exposition works because the events are dramatic, the stakes are high and the characters can be identified with. Who, hunting in the dessert, isn't going to try to take the $2.4 million that's sitting there? Knowing what he's going to be up against, anyone who would turn that challenge down would NOT be hunting impala in the West Texas desert.

I'd take the challenge, and you'll have an easier time finding Elvis alive than me in the West Texas dessert on a hunting lark.

[QUOTE=nathaniel parker;1043870]I read The Road to see what all the hullabaloo was about and it stunk. Nothing but page after page of him telling us how grey and ashen and leaden everything is. There were a couple of good scenes in there but overall a snoozer.
Completely turned me off of bothering to check out any of his other work. There's just too much other stuff out there to check out to give him a second chance right now.[/QUOTE]

The Road I couldn't hang with. I'll try again, but I agree: it's the same thing I commented on the Border Trilogy, sometimes he takes exposition to painful points.

But he makes up for it with this one book, which looks to be a kick-ass movie. I haven't been this stoked about a film coming out since LOTR.

[QUOTE=Barca Boy;1043040]As soon as I finish Confederancy of Dunces and Heartsick Im reading NCFOM.[/QUOTE]

There's also a fantastic audiobook version of No COuntry for Old Men read by Tom Stecschulte. I recommend it.

[QUOTE=tomstrong83;1044061]There's also a fantastic audiobook version of No COuntry for Old Men read by Tom Stecschulte. I recommend it.[/QUOTE]

It is a great audiobook, even if the narrator's name is unpronounceable.

Up there with Motherless Brooklyn read by Frank Muller and Underworld read by Richard Poe as audiobooks go.

Plus, in the audio format you don't have to be annoyed that McCarthy refused to use quotation marks...

[QUOTE=Chixulub;1044088]It is a great audiobook, even if the narrator's name is unpronounceable.

Up there with Motherless Brooklyn read by Frank Muller and Underworld read by Richard Poe as audiobooks go.

Plus, in the audio format you don't have to be annoyed that McCarthy refused to use quotation marks...[/QUOTE]

Richard Poe is pretty fantastic.
I've never listened to the Motherless Brooklyn, but I'll have to. That was a damn good book.

On the strength of these compact reviews, I've downloaded the audiobook of NCFOM.

[QUOTE=tomstrong83;1044599]Richard Poe is pretty fantastic.
I've never listened to the Motherless Brooklyn, but I'll have to. That was a damn good book.[/QUOTE]

OMG, that book is great but the audio book, Motherless Brooklyn is the reason we have audio books.

I worked for a guy with Tourette's for five years, I know what I'm talking about, and Muller did his fucking homework on that one. Maybe the best audio book ever. Ever.

[QUOTE=Chixulub;1044088]It is a great audiobook, even if the narrator's name is unpronounceable.

Up there with Motherless Brooklyn read by Frank Muller and Underworld read by Richard Poe as audiobooks go.

Plus, in the audio format you don't have to be annoyed that McCarthy refused to use quotation marks...[/QUOTE]

I dislike quotation marks, so aside from the confusion that sometimes comes from it, I enjoy when authors don't use them. Though I don't mind using the apostrophe in lieu of quotation marks...I usually do that, except when writing an official document for work.

I was at Barnes and Noble last night and I started reading No Country. I was like three chapters in before I realized how much I read. That story really grabbed me. Only problem is - not really a problem, but fore site - I left my money and debit card at home. I think I'm going to order it from Amazon tonight though.

[QUOTE=tom9d;1045242]I dislike quotation marks, so aside from the confusion that sometimes comes from it, I enjoy when authors don't use them. Though I don't mind using the apostrophe in lieu of quotation marks...I usually do that, except when writing an official document for work.[/QUOTE]

I think if the reader has to stop and think about whether this is something 'said' or something 'thought,' it's a problem. And even a great writer like Cormac McCarthy can't tell a story without using quotation marks without making the reader puzzle over that.

I don't mind demanding art, I enjoy it, but the payoff has to be there. I'm all for withholding things that give the reader an 'aha' moment, but whether a guy was speaking or thinking, or who was speaking or thinking should not be the mystery.

Still, a story that good, you forgive the arrogance of the author. And yes, it's still arrogance even when you're great, at least when it's something that doesn't contribute to your greatness; something you wouldn't get away with if it weren't for all the other things you do so incredibly right.

[QUOTE=PGoutis01;1045322]I was at Barnes and Noble last night and I started reading No Country. I was like three chapters in before I realized how much I read. That story really grabbed me. Only problem is - not really a problem, but fore site - I left my money and debit card at home. I think I'm going to order it from Amazon tonight though.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, it gets its hooks in fast. I can't remember how fast I got through it first time, but it was probably a two day read, and that's as fast as I get through a full length novel. Ever.

I guess I read Jonathan Livingston Seagull in one evening, but that was something like 25 years ago.

Im reading NCFOM next and Mirka is kindly sending me a copy of Blood Meridien.

You'll love it dude, I did. And my opinion influences you all.

[QUOTE=corellion;1063867]You'll love it dude, I did. And my opinion influences you all.[/QUOTE]

You don't run out of steam do you?

Lucky you reminded me...

I finished NCFOM recently and I was totally disappointed. It felt loose, incomplete and sometimes just uninteresting. The dialogue that ran for pages was unfocused to the point of stupidity, and the ending chapters were superfluous and try-hard. Plus, it was preachy, but preached nothing.

I'm enjoying The Road more. And Blood Meridian keeps seeming like a better book to me as time passes. Too bad NCFOM was a disappointment.

I've struggled with The Road. I'll have to revisit, but I do agree NP that it was a lot of the same description of ash and ruin. He's just very dense. A book like this could take me six months to read. But, I pushed my way through Glamorama, and Barack Obama's book, because I felt they were important, so I'll do the same with The Road. There is a LOT to enjoy there, but just don't pick it up thinking it's going to be a quick, easy read. Interesting that some people here LOVE it and some HATE it. That says something.

[QUOTE=Mr. Brown;1063902]You don't run out of steam do you?[/QUOTE]
It's tongue in cheek brown.

I just read Child Of God.  My dictionary was used a lot during it, which is a good thing.  His descriptions of things seemed fresh and original.  It was well written, but having no experience with the following: necrophelia, incest or Sevier County, Tennessee, it was tough to get in to.

no country is good blood meridian is his best and i would say that the road is one of the most overrated books in the history of the world.  besides religous texts is the most overrated.